Sage Thrive Today Blog Student Mental Health Episode 11: Nancy Sulla on Engaging Students in a Hybrid Learning Environment

Episode 11: Nancy Sulla on Engaging Students in a Hybrid Learning Environment

Welcome to our podcast: Conversations About Student Mental Health.

I’m Chris Leonard, Clinical Social Worker working with adolescents for over 25 years. In this podcast, I talk with school administrators, educators, clinicians, and parents to open a dialogue that will help the growing number of students struggling with mental illness.

Chris Leonard:

Welcome back to Conversations About Student Mental Health. I really hope the summer has provided you with some opportunities to rest and refresh. Of course, if you’re like most school professionals or parents, your summer has been filled with planning, re-planning, and more re-planning to resume school in the fall.

Of necessity, much of our planning has focused on health and safety, including ensuring social distancing, arranging transportation, procuring PPE, and creating student cohorts. But what about our preparations for instruction?

We’ve all seen numerous national news reports declaring this spring’s remote learning a disaster. We know that according to the National Center for Education Statistics, that 14% of US students, that’s about 9.4 million, don’t even have proper digital access. And this is a significant concern. Numerous reports and surveys describe how even students with digital access and their parents were profoundly disappointed with the instruction they received during the lockdown.

Chris Leonard:

Students and parents were understandably worried about not feeling engaged, lacking socialization, and being just plain bored. And although schools are trying desperately to create the conditions for safe in-person learning, most systems are finding they will have to start the year in a hybrid mix of in-person and remote learning.

My guest today has developed a game-changing model for hybrid instruction that provides opportunities for students to be more engaged, more interactive, and more successful in hybrid learning environments. Engaging students meaningfully and encouraging lots of interaction promotes better academic progress and also supports mental health. I am truly excited to welcome Dr. Nancy Sulla to the show.

Chris Leonard:

Dr. Sulla is the author of five books on creating student driven, blended learning environments. She’s also a national speaker and thought leader in transforming learning environments to build student engagement, empowerment, and efficacy. Her instructional plan for designing hybrid learning environments is giving teachers hope for an entirely new look for schooling. Nancy, I want to thank you so much for taking time from your incredibly busy schedule to join us today.

Nancy Sulla:

Thank you, Chris.

Chris Leonard:

It’s really great to have you, so let’s jump in. First of all, since this podcast is about student mental health, some of our listeners may be wondering just how a model of hybrid instruction applies. Can you talk a little bit about how your instructional model helps support not only academic success, but social and emotional health?

Nancy Sulla:

That’s a great question. And I actually think there are some benefits. I’m actually finding that some of the students who have found school a little fearful, especially when you talk about the middle grades where students have to navigate their way through the social aspects of school, are actually benefiting from being home a little bit more. And I think the hybrid model is actually going to allow them to engage in school, but then have a little bit of a rest and then come back and engage again.

Nancy Sulla:

But within the model, in terms of the structures, I believe that students need the five aspects, if you will.

One is that students really need a connection to their teacher. And so one of the things we recommend is that teachers offer a morning video every morning, one or two minutes that just says, “Hello students, it’s Tuesday.” Whatever that would be that students can actually watch, see their teacher’s face, and feel that connection even if they’re home.

Nancy Sulla:

I believe that students also have a need for the known, especially in a time when so much is unknown. So for instance, instead of coming to school and waiting for the teacher to take the reins, we recommend an activity list that students can have access to so they will literally see the activities in which we’ll be engaging today or across the week. So they have a sense of comfort in knowing something about what’s going on, their instructional activities.

I believe students also have a need to be seen, and I’m not a fan of the whole class video conference where you’re trying to connect with 20-25 students at once. I am a fan of small group mini lessons. So now the teacher can be on video with just a small number of students and in a hybrid world, they could actually have two students in class, two or three students at home, all coming together so that the student really gets to be seen and heard. And I think that’s important.

Nancy Sulla:

I also believe, particularly in these times, reflection is very important and allows students to think about, “How did I feel about that lesson or about what I’m learning? How did I experience it? What else do I want to know?” So we implement something called an efficacy journal, which is intended to move students to being more efficacious, feeling like they can tackle anything, as I like to say, like they can change the world. And so that reflection piece should be built in every day.

Nancy Sulla:

And finally, students need to know there’s always support. I’m a very big fan of a variety of types of videos that teachers and or their school-based colleagues would film so that students can always go back and watch it again.

You don’t get that in a live lesson. You can’t rewind the teacher, but you can rewind a video, pause it, start again, et cetera. So I think those five, the connection, the need to have the known, to be seen, to be reflective, and to know you have the support will really help ground students in this very different way of looking at school.

Chris Leonard:

That’s really great, Nancy. You actually anticipated one of my questions. I was going to ask you about live streaming, because I know that you had critiqued that in the past. If anybody had any doubt about the connection between this hybrid learning model and mental health, I think you have more than answered that question. In terms of providing students with a sense of connection, with a sense of connecting to something that’s known (because there is so much uncertainty right now and this is something that adults and children are really struggling with), the opportunity to be seen, the opportunity to engage in reflection, and to receive support. Those are just obviously all such components of good mental health.

Nancy Sulla:

Thank you. And now I’m curious about that second question since apparently I’m reading your mind.

Chris Leonard:

Yeah. You were reading my mind because, look, in talking with colleagues, some of the feedback that parents gave, what they wanted was their kids to be engaged.

And so I think the assumption that everybody has is, “Let’s recreate the classroom.” Right? So, “If we’ve got half the kids in school and half the kids at home, let’s make sure that half the kids at home can have the same experience that the kids are having in school.” Which is kind of impossible, but I think that’s what a lot of people are aiming for.

And what you’re pointing out is that a kind of “stand and deliver” experience isn’t the best thing to engage kids anyway.

Nancy Sulla:

Right, right.

Chris Leonard:

So, kids can be more engaged, can feel more seen, can feel much more of a connection with the teacher. If the teacher is recording any kind of whole group experience and whatever that mini lesson is, it’s not terribly long. But there’s also a huge advantage in the kids being able to go back and replay it and replay it again and listen to it as many times as they like. And then to be able to conference, either individually or in a small group with the teacher, to really gain the maximum benefit.

Nancy Sulla:

Absolutely.

Chris Leonard:

Yeah. So another thing I was thinking about, I was reading that your white paper, which was excellent and I’ve shared it with my teams-

Nancy Sulla:

Thank you.

Chris Leonard:

… But another thing you highlight in your white paper is the super skills, as you call them, that teachers can leverage in a typical live classroom. And you point out that in a hybrid environment, teachers need new super skills. So can you tell us more about the super skills that people need in a hybrid environment?

Nancy Sulla:

Yeah, I’m kind of fond of these. I think what happened in March when schools closed, everyone was wondering what to do. I think there was a certain sense of denial, “Well, this will just be for a week or two.” None of us knew what was going on.

And I think that while schools gave it their best shot at trying to figure out how to continue to provide instruction, I do believe that teachers were not engaged with students in live ways enough. And I think that for whatever the reasons that that was happening, I feel like parents were feeling as though their students were just home working on their own, and that made parents nervous. And parents started asking schools, “We want more teacher time. We want more live streaming.”

So I always said, “Be careful what you wish for, because what you don’t want is more live streaming. What you do want is more teacher engagement with your students.”

Nancy Sulla:

But there’s another way to get there. When teachers have their class in the physical classroom and you’re looking at 10, 20 students, 25 students in a classroom, as you’re offering your lesson, you can look around, scan the faces and see who has that furrowed brow look and you can launch right into more explanation. You can see when a light bulb goes off in a student’s head. You can call on that student and ask them to explain what they’re thinking. If you have a distraction… like I remembered as a teacher when a bee flew in the classroom… you could pause instruction and then pick up with it later. When you’re live streaming, you lose all of that. You don’t have that ability anymore.

Nancy Sulla:

If you’re presenting slides on a screen, for instance, you don’t see all of those students’ faces and they’re generally the size of postage stamps. So you can’t really see what’s going on in their brains with a whole class.

At the same time, you usually have students muted so that you don’t have the distractions from home. But then you don’t know what distractions they’re up against. So if you are presenting critical content live where it’s one shot, you either get it or you missed it, there are too many opportunities for students to miss it when they’re just home live streaming.

So what I suggest instead is, again, a little bit more of a dependence on videos, but videos that the teachers make. So I would record my lesson and within that video, I have the ability to be somewhat engaging. For instance, I can say to the student, “So pause the video and try this problem on your own and then start the video again when you think you have the answer.”

Nancy Sulla:

When they pause the video and then start it again, the teacher can say, “All right, so here’s the answer I got. Let me tell you how I got it. Let’s see if that’s how you got it.” So the teacher can do a little bit of back and forth in an instructional video. And the advantages that a student, whether they’re in school or home, can watch that video as many times as they need. And I think that’s a real equity issue that allows students access.

And then when the teacher does bring the group together (and I still recommend not the full class, but maybe half class at a time), you can have what I call a benchmark discussion, benchmarking meaning at this particular point in the unit of study, I know you need this skill.

Nancy Sulla:

And think of the advantage of this: when most students are sitting before the teacher waiting for instruction, they don’t even know what the teacher’s about to present. And then as the teacher’s presenting it, their brains are trying to make sense of it. Then the teacher’s asking questions and they’re wondering, “Well, do I have it or don’t I have it?” And some students need more time.

So instead, let’s dispense with that. Let students grapple with content through watching a video, engaging in the activity list on a few learning activities. Then when the teacher brings them together, the teacher’s job is to use these four new super skills, and the first is to ask questions that explore students’ thinking: “What did you learn by watching the video and the activity list? What ideas do you have for how we could use this information? Where would it fit with what else we’re trying to do? How does it connect to something else we’ve learned?”

Nancy Sulla:

Just get kids talking. And then be an analyzer. So then you start to say, “Well, what if…” And you try to push their thinking a little bit more deeply into the content. Then you become a synthesizer. So you pull it all together and say, “Well, all right, so let’s just summarize this.” And you make sure that now students have heard you saying what it is that you’re making sure that they’ve learned.

And then you become the catalyst and you ask something that is going to push them to the next level. So, “If we can do this, then I wonder what would happen if…” And you get them all thinking about the next thing they’re going to learn so they’re very excited to go and watch the next video, work on the activity list, and come back for another discussion. Those are my new super skills.

Chris Leonard:

So it’s exploring student thinking. I think I missed one… becoming the synthesizer?

Nancy Sulla:

Analyzing.

Chris Leonard:

Analyzing. So you’re up at the top of Bloom’s Taxonomy.

Nancy Sulla:

Right, which you can’t be when you are offering live instruction for the first time.

So there’s two benefits. One is the benefit of letting students grapple with the content a little before they come. And I have to say to teachers, trust me, I’ve been doing this for decades. Students really can grapple with the discussion with information before you present it. And then that just makes your part when you’re discussing it even richer because the students are coming with something.

Chris Leonard:

Yes. And it also occurs to me that that grappling creates novelty. If you’re trying something out for the first time, it has novelty. And as you go through this process with the students, they trust that you’re not going to let them be in over their heads. You’re going to give them something that is appropriate for them to grapple with, and then you’re going to support them through a process of discovery and deepening their thinking as they go and always moving it up towards the higher levels rather than staying down in knowledge and comprehension.

Nancy Sulla:

Right.

Chris Leonard:

That’s repetitive and boring.

Nancy Sulla:

Right.

Nancy Sulla:

And that grappling allows the brain to make sense. The way you learn is you have to have a little cognitive dissonance, which means that your brain has to say, “Wait, I can’t make sense of this.” And then as you’re grappling with it, when you do find the answer, when you resolve that, what you learn sticks. And I think too often in learning, we want to jump in and save the student so that they don’t feel uncomfortable. It’s good to feel uncomfortable when you’re learning, and if it’s a productive feeling of being uncomfortable and students get used to that being okay, they will not only learn, but retain it much longer.

Chris Leonard:

That makes a great deal of sense. Definitely. It makes sense in terms of engaging them, in terms of peaking their interest, and it also makes sense in terms of what we know about how kids naturally learn.

Nancy Sulla:

I had a funny story: I was listening to a presentation today by a person who was candidating to work at the company. And she was presenting on Latin dancing. And as she talked about the beats, she said, “So it’s an eight beat step. It’s one, two, three forward, one, two, three backward.” Now I’m immediately saying one, two, three, one, two, three, that’s six. Why is it an eight beat step? And she said that several times. I was experiencing cognitive dissonance. Eight beats, but I’m only hearing six. What did I miss? What? So now my brain is paying attention, because now I want to know what the answer is.

Nancy Sulla:

And then all of a sudden she says (and it was the Cha-Cha), “So you step one, two, three, pause, one, two, three, pause.” She said that beat in there, the fourth beat and the eighth beat are actually like the silent E in a word. You don’t hear it, but it’s there. And I will never forget that. That will be with me forever because I had the appropriate cognitive dissonance. I wasn’t drowning in it, and it was short… within a minute or so, I had the answer. I was like, “Oh my God, that makes so much sense.” And I was a happy learner. I think we need to do that more in school.

And I do believe you can do that when you’re offering a video activity list and then coming back together to have that discussion.

Chris Leonard:

That’s a great sequence. So you’re giving the students the opportunity to experience something on their own, bring something to the table with you. There’s a selection of activities for them to choose from to help them prepare, and now you’re bringing them together and you’re not bringing them together in that postage stamp environment where they’re one of 25 or 30, but you’re bringing them together in an environment where there’s room for them to interact with you as the teacher and with each other.

Nancy Sulla:

Yes. And some people say to me, “Well, isn’t this the flipped classroom?” And I say that there are definitely commonalities, but I’m not expecting every student to go home and watch my video and then come in and discuss it. I want to offer a small inspirational video and then an activity list of options, one of which might be a further instructional video by myself or a colleague or something that’s on the web. And then what I can do in that activity list is I can differentiate.

So I have the ability to offer a variety of learning opportunities, not only differentiating for their cognitive level: “Am I ready to learn this? Or do I need to go back to the prerequisites?” But also learning styles: “Do I want to read this text? Do I want to work on an interactive website?” So that I think there’s a richness that teachers can build in, but it’s that same idea of flipping it to let students grapple with the context first and then come into class, which is the mindset behind the flipped classroom.

Chris Leonard:

Yes. Got it. So I think in a sense, you’ve kind of almost anticipated my next question again.

Nancy Sulla:

Oh, I’m good at this, huh?

Chris Leonard:

You really are. I think you know I’m a big fan of the work of Sir Ken Robinson, who has, since like 1998, he’s critiqued our factory model of education. And putting this factory model behind us is another piece that you talk about in your work. And in addition to that, during this current COVID-19 crisis, you emphasize that yes, this crisis is tough, it’s difficult, it’s painful, but it also presents an opportunity for us to reimagine student learning and design instruction that’s much more effective. So can you tell us a little bit more about the opportunity and about how this helps us transform education?

Nancy Sulla:

Sure. So I’ll start by saying, make your classroom more like a marketplace than a factory. I think that’s a good metaphor for it. Our factory model of education actually came out of Prussia over 100 years ago. And really a military model of how do we prepare people to be rote workers?

I remember that my mom worked in gear work. She simply sat at this station and every time the next gear came through, she put a drill through it, and all she had to do was make sure she didn’t put the drill through her finger. And I thought, “Wow, what a boring job.” But that was the factory model jobs of the day. And someone thought, “Well, we could do this with kids. We’re going to take everybody who’s eight years old and put them in one room. We’ll take everyone who’s nine years old and put them in another room.”

Nancy Sulla:

And we started sorting children. And then if you think about it and you really see this at the middle and upper levels, we take you and put you in a room where we fill you with math, then we move you down the conveyor belt to your English class and we fill you with English, then we move you down.

And it’s very funny when we start thinking about how factory-like we are. We even call the people that oversee the work “supervisors” which is a factory line job. The whole factory came out in the Second Industrial Revolution. We have since moved to a Third Industrial Revolution and we’re on the cusp now of a Fourth Industrial Revolution, in which technology is playing a major role, not only in enhancing our work and our lives, but computers are now actually designing the next level of computers.

Nancy Sulla:

And this can go very well or very poorly for us. So the more that we understand how we might be able to use technology, for example, the better able we will be to make sure that our world becomes morphed into the kind of place that we want it to be.

And along those lines, there is so much available through technology that we need to take advantage of. I often say, “Everything you need to learn is on the internet. Everything you need to learn is on the internet.” What’s not on the internet is that ability to analyze multiple pieces of information. And then synthesize them to look at the debate side of seeing multiple sides to a situation, and being able to communicate your ideas with another person about what you found on the internet. So we need to move teachers from being the person who has all of the information to just deliver it and fill the next student, to making the teachers the facilitators, curators, if you will, of a rich learning environment.

Nancy Sulla:

And if you think about a marketplace, you come in and you’re like, “Well, here’s what I need.” And then you find the piece, the materials, the foods, vegetables, whatever it is that you’re looking for (I guess a vegetable is a food!) but you find what you need. And then you start engaging with the marketplace people. And then they start talking about why this brand might be better than this brand or what it is that you need.

And if you think about it, a marketplace is a busy, buzzing place where everyone can get what they need as they move around and engage in discussions and engage with one another. And I see that that’s what a classroom should look like, whether all of the students are in it, all of the students are at home, or there’s a mix.

Chris Leonard:

That’s great. I love that-

Nancy Sulla:

Do you think Sir Ken would like that?

Chris Leonard:

I do think Sir Ken would like that. When you were talking about the students being in grades by age level, I was thinking about how he would characterize that. He said, “It’s almost as if we’ve organized students by date of manufacture.” And why is that the way in which we organize students for learning? Why do we group them in that way?” There’s no reason for it, other than, well, okay. They were born at that time, that’s about it.

Nancy Sulla:

And it made sense, right.

Chris Leonard:

That doesn’t mean that they have the things in common that they need, that it makes sense to put them all together. And furthermore, if you’re talking about a classroom that is much more like a marketplace than a factory, you’re giving students structured choices all the time and enabling them to steer their own ship, obviously with guidance, that completely takes them in a whole different direction for learning.

And it really, again, it’s much more aligned with how kids are naturally learners and toddlers are naturally learners. That’s why they’re into everything. They’re improvising all the time. So when you put kids in that kind of place where everybody has to do everything the same way at the same time, it actually interrupts the learning process rather than fosters it.

Nancy Sulla:

Absolutely. And this is our opportunity. I mean, it’s an unprecedented opportunity for us to be able to reboot education and think of it differently. Which is why I cringe when people are talking about, “Well just put a camera in the room and live stream the lesson at home.” Because that’s basically saying, “Uh oh, the factory broke down. So let’s figure out how we can just recreate it with technology.” Instead of saying, “No, no. Technology has to change the way we live and think.”

And that happened to me early in my career. I was a teacher at a time when teaching jobs were very hard to come by. And anyone who didn’t already have 11 years in was being laid off because we were having a reduction in students. And so I decided I would go off and do something else and I became a programmer analyst and taught myself programming and went off to the industry.

Nancy Sulla:

What was interesting is that technology just became a part of my life. It was the way we communicated, collaborated, shared information, and it was just part of my daily life. And then I just woke up one day and I said, “What are you doing? You always wanted to be a teacher. You always wanted to be in the field of education.” So I decided to come back and I came back and it was the early ’80s when schools were trying to bring computers into schools. And what was interesting is that when we first brought computers into schools, we set up a computer lab with a computer teacher and a computer curriculum.

And I walked in and scratched my head and thought technology was just seamlessly infused into my life out in that real world. So I designed a classroom model called The Learner Active Technology Infused Classroom, which was all about technology being used seamlessly through the day.

And I think this is our time to rethink, given everything we have now, if we had to start all over again and create an educational system, what could it look like? I mean, I might be a little pie in the sky here thinking that we could change it all, but we can at least start with some of the instructional pieces there.

Chris Leonard:

Well, I think you’re right that this does present a great opportunity. A colleague of mine also often makes reference to the education system as kind of being like big ships. Big ships take a long time to start. They take a long time to slow down. They take a long time to make a turn. So they’re not maneuverable. They have this very slow pace of changing momentum and inertia.

Nancy Sulla:

But the good news is a hurricane just came and ripped through our ship.

So now we have to think about, how do we transport differently instead of just rebuilding?

Chris Leonard:

So often opportunities grow out of crises. So it’s an excellent point.

Nancy Sulla:

And Chris, I just have to interject where you talked about students questioning at a very young age, how students really always ask, “Well, why this? Why, why, why?” I saw a graph recently that showed that students ask a tremendous number of questions up until age five and then their questions drop off significantly. I believe it is because once they head into school and they start firing out all those questions, the teachers say, “Okay, well, hold that question.” Or, “Well, that’s not what we’re talking about now.” And they very quickly learn school is not the place to ask questions.

Chris Leonard:

Yeah. Students become socialized to the factory and in the factory, it’s not a place for your individual questions. It’s time for you to be quiet and listen to what I have to say.

Nancy Sulla:

Right. Right.

Chris Leonard:

Exactly. We’re getting towards the end of our time, but another thing I was thinking about is, starting the year, and I think that teachers who really put a priority on the social and emotional health of their students, want to make sure they’re setting a positive tone and foundation early in the year. So going into this year, which is a little different, because we’re coming back after this lockdown and school is going to be different. What’s one piece of advice you would offer to teachers as they prepare to re-enter their classrooms this fall?

Nancy Sulla:

One of the things that I’ve been concerned about is that during the summer, schools have been preparing to change what the room looks like. So desks are being moved apart, plexiglass is being installed, little Xs on the floor determining where you can stand, where you can’t stand, people talking about lunch being at the student’s seat, students not really being able to engage too much with one another. There’s all of this.

I’ve been looking at some pictures of classrooms and all I keep thinking is, students who are just off doing summer in whatever ways they possibly can, are not thinking about this at all. For many students, when they come back to school, this is going to be a huge shock and I think that this could play out very poorly on social and emotional health when students suddenly hit that classroom. So I have been recommending to educators that they actually do a little video tour, film the classroom and film it in an exciting way.

Nancy Sulla:

And show them how this is going to keep you safe. So that students have a sense of it. And so it goes back to what I said on the first question, students need to be comforted by the known. So the more they know about that year coming in, the better. The more that teachers can explain in a video, sending it home and saying to the students, “Hi, I can’t wait to see you. Things are going to be a little different this year. Here’s how we’re going to do it.” I think kids will be better.

And I would say too, I have kindergarten teachers who will tell me how sad it is that students won’t be able to experience the kindergarten the way that it’s meant to be. And I just stopped them. And I say, “But just remember, of all those grade levels, the kindergarteners are the only ones who probably don’t know all that much about what school looks like, because they haven’t experienced anything yet.”

Nancy Sulla:

Your kindergarten students are your perfect opportunity to come in and start something different. And I think that the more that teachers can create videos… And the reason I say videos is, this is a video generation. Our kids today make their own videos, watch video clips, send video clips to their friends. I think that for them to have short, not long, videos can be a great way for them to absorb information. So I’m not saying we don’t use text anymore, by any stretch of the imagination, but I think a video of the teacher, the teacher’s face saying, “I’m so excited. 10 more days until we can start school. I wanted to share this with you.” Or, “I wanted to share that with you.” I think that that could make a world of difference to calm kids down, make them feel good, make them know their teacher in advance, so that they get to know the teacher in advance.

Nancy Sulla:

They get to see the classroom in advance. They get to hear about how some of us will be home and some of us will be in school. But look at this, we’re going to be able to actually use this little corner here to bring students in if they’re home. I think all of that would really help too. I call it priming and it’s really even pre-priming. Before they even get to school, reach out to your students and make sure that you’re connecting with them so that when they come into school on that first day, everything is already known.

Chris Leonard:

That makes a tremendous amount of sense and it fits right in with what you were saying about instruction. When you provide that kind of grounding for kids and that sense of the known, that sets them up to be ready for an important process of learning, which is being willing not to know. In order to learn, you have to recognize that you don’t know something and you have to be okay with not knowing something and grapple with it and have that cognitive dissonance, but you do need that sense of security to hold onto, and in a sense, now more than ever.

Nancy Sulla:

Yes, I love that, Chris. It’s like, let the cognitive dissonance be around academics where it belongs and not about where am I going to sit?

Chris Leonard:

Yes, definitely. Nancy, people are probably thinking, “Wow, where can I learn more?” I believe you’re working on a new book and I’d love to hear about that for a moment, but I think people would love to know where else can they go to learn more about your model?

Nancy Sulla:

So I have a couple of companies, but probably the one that you could head to right now and find the white paper at least is I-D-E C-O-R-P. That’s IDE Corp, stands for Innovative Designs for Education, IDECorp.com. I also have a site, NancySulla.com. So you can probably find more there. I have another company called EdQuiddity that provides virtual services to schools and businesses. So lots of places.

I am published by Routledge and I think probably if you just Google “Nancy Sulla books” or Nancy Sulla anything, you’ll find a lot of information. I have a book on executive function that has been helping a lot of teachers get ready for the fall, because we need to build executive function for students to succeed. But I’m also probably best known for this series, Students Taking Charge, which is about putting students in charge of their own learning. Still, that was written for a physical classroom. So now I am working on designing pre-K to 12 hybrid learning environments, learning anytime, anywhere.

Chris Leonard:

Excellent, excellent. That’s great stuff. And because this is a podcast, if you missed any of that, please rewind and listen again!

Nancy, I really want to thank you again for taking time because I know that you’re pretty busy and you’re always doing such good work for teachers and students, which I really appreciate. So thank you for being with us today.

Nancy Sulla:

Thank you. It was great to share and good luck. Stay safe.

Chris Leonard:

Thank you so much. And everyone, I just want to thank you for joining us again today and please do join us in the near future for more Conversations About Student Mental Health. Have a great rest of the summer.

Conversations About Student Mental Health is brought to you by Sage Thrive, partners in school-based mental wellness.

You can find the show notes on our website at www.sagethrivetoday.com. You can also suggest topics for upcoming episodes of the podcast; we’d love to know what issues related to student mental health you want to hear more about.

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